Ep 46: Communicating your higher calling featuring Chuck Garcia

Episode 46 of Rethink Financial Advice, co-hosted by Derek Notman, CFP® (Founder & CEO, Couplr AI) and H. Adam Holt, CFP® (Founder & CEO, Asset-Map). (33:26)

Episode 46 of Rethink Financial Advice, co-hosted by Derek Notman, CFP® (Founder & CEO, Couplr AI) and H. Adam Holt, CFP® (Founder & CEO, Asset-Map). Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or Acast.

Episode Summary

Chuck Garcia joins Adam Holt and Derek Notman to argue that when a client does not understand something, responsibility sits almost entirely with the person speaking. Garcia, who teaches communication at Columbia and spent his career at Bloomberg, BlackRock, and Citadel, offers a metaphor the hosts adopt immediately: they do not speak your language, but they are not deaf, so stop raising the volume. His counterintuitive alternative is to lower it, on the reasoning that people lean in for something compelling rather than something loud. The practical failure he describes will be familiar to any advisor. A meeting spent transferring the maximum possible amount of information, followed by a fee, followed some months later by an email announcing a change of advisor. His fix is to slow down and find out what the client does not know first.

What this episode covers

• Where responsibility for being understood actually sits in a client conversation
• Why volume and detail are the wrong response to a client who is not following
• The information-dump meeting, and the client departure that tends to follow it
• Asking what a client does not know before making any recommendation
• Why Garcia thinks investors habitually ask their advisors the wrong question

Full Transcript

Machine-generated transcript of this episode.

Welcome to Rethink, the financial advisor podcast. My name is Adam Holtz. And this is Derek Notman. We are your hosts, both veteran advisors and FinTech CEOs who challenge the status quo, question everything and have fun doing it. Hear honest commentary on the challenges facing advisors today. And be part of a community where we can all rethink the profession. Now on to our episode. Adam, do you understand me if I yell at you? Oh my, my ears are destroyed. Derek, if I respond in a whisper, does that make it even more clear? The answer is no. No, no. What? What are you talking about? Let me rephrase, Adam.

Okay. Who’s responsibility is it to ensure communication? The speaker, the listener, both. Oh, now that’s kind of fun. Honestly, I don’t wanna do the whole episode yelling. I don’t wanna whisper in everybody’s ear. You know, that might drive us crazy. Yeah, it’ll drive our listeners crazy. You know, it’s such a fun question because I can imagine this debate might go on for at least 35 minutes just on who’s responsible or whose fault it was when it breaks down. Because my gut tells me if somebody is trying to communicate something, it’s predominantly the person who’s trying to transfer that information to the recipient. So I would say it’s mostly the communicator versus the communicative.

Okay, so you’re saying it’s both, but really mainly the person communicating, the person speaking. I’m assuming the communicative, the recipient didn’t ask for the communication, right? Or maybe is expecting it. I don’t really know the context of this conversation. So since you asked me the question, I think it’s your responsibility to figure out what the heck you’re talking about when you ask me the question. I’m probably confused here. Who’s turn is it now? I don’t know. Well, I think we can answer this question a little bit better by having someone who actually knows what they’re talking about. Possibly. That would be helpful. So we’ve got a pretty cool guest today in Chuck Garcia.

Great guy that I actually met online as a referral to a PR agency that I might end up using. So funny how this all works. And he and I just hit it off great. And it’s funny, his PR agency didn’t set this up by the way. We did this because we had a relationship, but really cool guy. He’s up in New York and has been a professional speaker many times over. He’s a best-selling author of a book called A Climb to the Top, which I have. He’s on the faculty at Columbia University grad school as part of their engineering professional development and leadership program. And he jokes about that a little bit.

You’ll have to listen. But he’s also been on Wall Street and he’s worked at Black Rock, Citadel, and even did a stint where he was working directly for Michael Bloomberg, which was I’m sure just a really interesting experience. Also a world traveler and loves to climb mountains. So just a dynamic, really well-spoken communicator. Very well. And that was my experience too. I was very impressed with Chuck’s ability to control his message. Now you probably know this because you and I spent too much time. I tend to be very intentional about the words that I use, right? Everything from my tone and inflection. My family rolls their eyes.

They’re like, oh, did you enunciate, Adam? I’m like, yes, because I take it personally that it’s my job to communicate with the recipient and for me to be as good as possible in communicating that idea so that you can take that information and respond, grow, evolve from it. And since we do podcasts, Derek, all the time, I tend to think about it more than ever. And we both speak now on these stages. So we have to be good presenters. But the question from financial advisor is we’re actually presenting all the time. And we’re tending to present complicated information to someone who may or may not be interested in that detailed information.

And so this all started to tie together. And one of the things, Derek, I want everybody to really listen to ears. Listen to the intentionality of Chuck’s tonality, his storytelling, his lack of um-likes, you know. He’s a craftsperson here. And that’s really what I was hoping that everybody has an opportunity to listen to and then question, can I do this better? Can I communicate better? And he dropped so many nuggets here. So I’m excited for you all to hear this. Are you ready, Derek? Let’s do it. All right, let’s hear from Chuck Garcia. So Chuck, what’s important about what you’re doing that you want people to know?

I am grateful for the opportunity every day to go to work in the service of someone else’s success. And I say that because for 30 years, I thought about me. I had a family to raise. I needed to make money. I didn’t come for money. But I was a finance major in college with a couple of dreams. First is to make my parents proud. Second was go to Wall Street. Third was to travel the world. I am grateful that I’ve done all of that. And now I get to give it all back. So tell us, what are you doing now to give back? 10 years ago, I descended a mountain in Alaska called Mount Bono.

And I became a mountaineer because on 9-11, I was scheduled to speak on the 107th floor of the World Trade Center. Three of my colleagues were in the building waiting for me because it was my speech to give. And I never made it into the building and they never made it out. From that moment on, I started climbing because I knew I couldn’t change what were the circumstances in front of me, but there was one thing I could change. That was myself. I didn’t know exactly what that meant, whether I was looking to find myself or to lose myself, but I knew I needed to do something different.

And I grew up in a winter wonderland in upstate New York surrounded by snow and I’ve skied and skated all my life. But I used to see all these people climbing mountains and I said, I wonder what that is. And then just before 9-11, I read a book called Indus and Arab by John and John Krakauer. And I saw myself in that book. I said, oh my God, this is so cool. Well, he was talking about people on mountains dying and I’m talking about getting on a mountain living. So I redefined, what am I gonna do with my life? And exactly one year later, I stood on the summit of Mount Rainier in the Cascade Mountains in Washington.

It unleashed the beast and I never looked back. But I say that as a pretext because about 15 years later, I climbed a mountain in Alaska called Mount Bona and it’s in the defines the middle of nowhere. You take these little glacier planes, you fly to the middle of nowhere, you’ve dropped off at 10,000 feet with a bunch of gear and two weeks later, the plane comes back and God willing, we get back and we go home. But Adam, to answer your question, it was on that mountain when I had these incredible inspirational guides. You read people who were half my age who were extraordinary in their kindness and generosity to get mere mortals like me up and down the mountain.

And I started to look at them and I said, oh my goodness, look what they do every day. They don’t do it in an office. It doesn’t matter where they do it, but it helped me to see, holy my goodness, could I see myself in that? So to end this story, to make a short story even longer, I went home and when I got home, I broke out my computer. I went into something called LegalZoom. I put on a credit card for $600. I quit my job at Citadel, one of the biggest, most baddest, prestigious hedge funds in the world and I resigned. And I formed a company, my company is called Klein Leadership.

I’m an executive coach to many companies, mostly Wall Street companies. And then the other part of my life, I am on the faculty proudly in a place called Columbia University where I teach in the graduates. And I teach engineers, teach them engineering. I teach engineers how to wake up every day and how to do two things, how to communicate, which is the outside. And I teach them emotional intelligence inside. So I teach first, help them. How do they stay calm under the weight of enormous expectations? And then when they’re ready to communicate, what do I do that communicates you the brain? That’s what I say.

Chuck, you were at Citadel, you’ve been on Wall Street. You spent a lot of time at Bloomberg. Given your experience, what is your perspective of the financial advice market as you see it today? Yeah. And for context, my experience from Bloomberg to BlackRock to Citadel allowed me to see the financial markets from a vantage point of a professional. I want to answer from the vantage point on a more personal. And I state that because when I told people I was on Wall Street, they’d ask, do you have any tips? And I said to them, you’re asking the wrong question because the question that you’re asking for me is to tell you something that could generate a transaction that for you, you want to get rich.

But I studied Warren Buffett for most of my life and Warren Buffett does not invest in glamour stocks. He doesn’t like he invest in very boring. In fact, if you look at Daiko Insurance, these are dull businesses and no 20 year old wants to invest in adult business. They want to invest in Snapchat, GPT, Google, anything like that. So my point is, and I really like the question, but my statement is that the financial advice market is sadly misunderstood. The majority of people have no idea what you’re talking about. If you ask any of your clients, tell me the difference between a value stock and a growth stock, they’re going to look at you crooked, like what do you mean?

When you tell them what’s the Dow Jones and the S&P and then you even get onto the bond market, now their head is spinning. So from my point of view, when I was inside at Blackrock and Citadel and my clients were very large arch companies, well-educated people, first in finance, that’s one answer. But the majority of people there walking around New York City haven’t the slightest clue what we’re talking about and I don’t think anybody’s speaking to them. I think most of your industry, I admire what you do. I have a wealth manager myself, but you’re not talking to mom, even my wife. My wife is a very smart woman.

You’re not talking to her and you should be. You should, in fact, if I were you and I love what you’re doing here, you should educate your clients before you offer to give them advice. Teach them, what is the difference? Why does Warren Buffett advertise Geico? A boring business. Every month, an annuity of paying insurance. Not one of my Columbia students understands what he does. They just know he’s worth a hundred billion dollars, but they think that to get rich, you got to invest in the next Google. Warren Buffett is the complete opposite. He said, you guys got it all wrong. That’s why he’s a contrarian.

And I think for you guys, you’re talking about the trends. You’re talking about what’s cool, what’s late. Buffett is the complete opposite. He’s talking about the downtrodden, the down, look for the stocks that are not that because historically year over year, they perform better. Yep, my drift. Yeah, we love of course that context and so many of the financial advisors definitely came from the stock world. And then of course, wealth management has evolved so much. So some of the work that you’re doing on emotional intelligence is obviously getting a little bit more attention these days, right? It’s not taboo to talk about EQ. And I’m curious for this space.

What do you think the missing opportunity is that advisors just can’t say? I think advisors do a very good job with a bullhorn. All of them talking about the bull, so we should do this and we should do that. But they don’t get to it at the individual level. They talk in very big terms. But when you’re speaking to somebody, rather than communicating and advertising in a billboard, oh, we really like Google. We think we should buy that. I think you should find a way to help them understand why they’re investing in what they do, why it’s a great company, not just this great company.

It has to be a great company at a bargain price. That’s the Warren Buffett mantra. Great companies are okay if you buy it at too high a price, that’s not a good investment. It’s still a great company. So my point is help people to understand that you invest in a great company does not mean it’s a great investment. It’s only a great investment when you invest in it at the right price. Nobody sees that, and I don’t say nobody, that’s not fair. The market in general, you walk the 50 states and you meet people who don’t have the education that you and Derek and I have, and most people do not.

They don’t understand. They think if I invest in a great company and they’re disappointed why it didn’t return more, because they didn’t get the investment right. They got the company, they got the investment wrong. And from my point of view, I think you should tell people that. People don’t understand that. Great companies at a bargain price, that’s what makes a good investment. You ask most of the people, what’s a bargain price? What’s Google trading at? How do they know what’s a bargain price? Only if Warren Buffett says so, but I don’t hear you guys talking that way. I can almost say that what you just shared could be used as an analogy for so many other things.

I know we’re talking about stock picking and investing, but when it comes to leadership, emotional intelligence with their money, family, business, whatever, I’m sure even in the leadership things that you do, you see stuff like this, or you could probably use that analogy to get a point across to one of the folks that you work with, I’m sure. Yeah, and what I’m talking about, Derek, many of us who grew up in our generation, we read a book called The Seven Habits of Highly Affected. Everybody knows Stephen Covey. And when you read the Stephen Covey book, there’s seven things to say, do this. I wasn’t crazy about the book, but I loved the principles that he espoused.

And one of them that he articulated, Derek, was, seek first to understand, pause for dramatic effect, and then to be understood. I’ve added, when I start to teach this, in that order, think about this. Seek first to understand, then to be understood. Your state of Florida, what your politicians are doing, you’re all screaming over each other. New York City, what are our politicians? They’re not talking to each other. They’re screaming over each other. I am not seeing politicians seeking first to understand. They say, you can have any opinion you want as long as it’s mine. And if not, it’s moral outrage and indignation, and I’m gonna put it on Twitter and say what an idiot you are.

When did we get to a world, and it’s very sad, where you and I can have bitter disagreements philosophically and politically, that makes for great dinner conversations, and we’re still gonna be friends, and I’ll still buy you dessert and coffee. That’s how it should be. But I’ve had friends that defriended other friends after 40 years of friendship because they didn’t like their politics. They didn’t stop first to understand why does he or she have that point of view. They only care that they do. The emotional intelligence factors into this, because this is where empathy comes into play. I don’t necessarily agree with my own brother, whose politics are completely different than mine, and I love my brother.

He is the greatest Jew in the world, but our politics are different. When he and I are at the dinner table, I seek first to understand, not because I’m a great human being, I’m just trying to understand his point of view. I’m not even gonna try to move him to my cause until I understand where he’s coming from. What many people do in their defensive reactions when they don’t get that connection of understanding, they raise the volume. People aren’t deaf, but that’s what we do. But if we just scream it louder, and I think you see that a lot when people are translating. If they’re speaking to someone whose language is not yours and they’re not understanding, notice, go to the streets of Paris or Milan.

Notice what people do when they’re ordering that coffee and not getting it. I wanted a line, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. The volume goes up. I saw that in a I Love Lucy episode where Ricky was translating and he said to Lucy, they don’t speak your language, but they’re not deaf. Stop raising the volume. I use that as a metaphor for what is happening as a guy who teaches communications. People ask me, what do you see? Stop raising the volume. In fact, if you whisper, that might be more effective. You’re leaning in. This is the Sheryl Sandberg. Why would we lean in? Because it’s interesting and compelling, not because the volume is high.

And Derek, that’s what I think. I think it’s just, you got, you know, I really admire what you guys do. You’re managing other people’s well. That is awesome. And it is a high calling, but it’s misunderstood hope. And I love this thing, this episode here, to the extent that we can teach and help people to educate them on this. This is beautiful. And this, I just love to see more of this. Was there anything that you think we need to hear as a community or to be debated amongst us that’s just not being talked about? Yeah, I think the first thing you should do with the other financial advisors, let the people have the money you manage.

Let them feel your sense of enormous responsibility. Stop using the word fiduciary. Don’t be using complex words. Don’t talk like that. Oh, you know, and I see these commercials. Oh, we’re fiduciary. Oh, okay. That makes it all better. Let them know it’s a high call and how privileged you are to manage their money and what an enormous responsibility it is, the fact that you had been entrusted with their life’s wealth. We don’t do that. We just start counting how much money did he make. That’s what the advertisers should say. They should say, Mr. and Mrs. Jones came here from Cuba. They work like dogs. They accumulated a half a million dollars and they worked so hard, they didn’t wanna see it evaporate.

So they came to us. What a privilege, what an honor and a responsibility we have to ensure that we not just preserve the capital. Now we have to grow it. That’s what I wanna hear in the advertisements, Adam, and I don’t see it that way. So there you have it. What’d you think about that session? So well-spoken, lots of good nuggets. Got into the weeds a little bit with the Warren Buffett stuff, which that’s not this podcast, but everything else. It just really resonates. His story about 9-11, I mean, talk about, it just makes you think that tomorrow is not guaranteed. And look at what happened and look how he took that moment to understand himself better and then go help others.

It’s remarkable. It really is. I love his yelling versus whispering. And don’t worry, I’m not gonna yell at you anymore. It’s okay. Okay, I’m gonna whisper back at you because I am committed to communicating my clearly accurate side of the story no matter what you think, right? I thought that was really kind of interesting how it’s segwayed into the question of, and I’ve seen this a hundred times, right? People, anyone who speaks a different language than you, they say they slow down and they speak like this. I’m asking for some tilapia, please. Like I can, like I’m shaping it with my mouth. You know, does that work?

No, like let’s pay attention actually. But you know what’s really interesting? I found that he’s, even though he started with a bit of an origin story, you could hear the storytelling nature. I was really sucked in. Obviously I remember that event very well. Everyone knows somebody that was affected personally or indirectly from 9-11. And obviously I’m up here in the New York area. And so it wasn’t uncommon for us to hear how gratitude for a life experience, especially one around survival caused him to push himself to another height. And it really awoken this empathetic piece, which I’m sure he always had, but now his awareness to help people think about the recipient of the information, right?

The speaker is constantly trying to communicate. We think people are frustrated. I’m trying to communicate this idea, complicated, passionate, political, polarizing, or just basic stuff. And we tend to be very lazy about our communication. We mumble it, we’re not really clear. We assume people already understand what we’re talking about, but we have no awareness in many cases about the recipient. And I think that’s where our communication falls down. He brought that up in maybe four or five different areas. It seemed completely different. Even the Buffett thing. It’s like, what was he talking about? He was really talking about seeking to help people understand why it’s important to understand why this is a good investment.

Because when they understand why, now all of a sudden they can be part of the conversation. Understanding is at the core. And I think he did it really well, our job articulating what understanding means and listening to understand, but also understanding yourself so you can better understand those around you. And I think that’s what makes him a really great communicator. There’s no doubt. What did you take away? I mean, what are the couple bullets that you think advisors can put into action in their own worlds? Well, I liked his slow down to understand or to seek understanding comments. The financial advice space tends to be faster moving, whether that’s from sales pressures or market pressures, or we’re just type A wired to run.

I think it is really important to slow down, seek that understanding so then you can be that much better of a communicator when you’re meeting with our clients. His comments about the enormity of the importance of the work that we do, helping our clients with their money, that really resonates. I think it’s okay for advisors to share that. That would be something else is when you’re having these meetings with clients, whether it’s a first time or a review after 20 years, let them know how important it is to you what the work that you do together is. And I think that resonated with me quite a bit.

And then his whole piece, we’ve talked about this Adam on multiple episodes, educate first, educate, educate, educate. Don’t use big fancy terms. Once you understand the person and yourself, then seek to educate them, then the advice and all the other stuff will flow. So those aren’t concrete things. Those are more smoke. It’s up there. It’s wispy. It’s there. It comes together though. I just realized by listening to you, and I’m gonna wing it right here. What I just realized is I’m gonna make this up on the fly. Ready? I’m gonna apply Chuck Garcia to financial advice. Here it is. In the next meeting with your client, before you talk about anything about the performance allocation, planning, any of that stuff, you’re gonna ask them a question.

What do you need to know or understand that I haven’t done a great job already communicating? Then hopefully they’re going to tell you, and you’re gonna take that time to educate them on that. Before you take any time out of your agenda, you’re gonna make sure that you’re on the same page. You’re gonna educate them, okay? Then you’re going to ask them, was that clear? Is there anything else I can do to help you? This is, we’re actually talking about how do we actually execute applying empathy, right? Emotional intelligence. And when they ask you, well, why are you asking this question differently? You’re gonna say, because I take this very seriously.

I know how important it is for you to achieve success. Your very life savings, the trust you’ve given me and my team is all riding on the decisions that we make today. And I wanna make sure that you understand this journey at every point. That’s the role I’m playing for you. That’s a fiduciary. That’s an advocate. So I think what Chuck is really saying is we need to stop. George Kinder mentioned this a bunch of times, right? He mentioned, you gotta listen first. But I think many advisors need a playbook, right? So- Yeah, okay, I’m listening, I’m understanding. Now what, right? Like how specifically do I execute that?

Other than just emotionally being aware of, yeah, I should probably ask them if they understand me. But I only have 25 minutes because the Zoom meeting is gonna end and I gotta go to the next meeting and we have to get through all this content. And you know what? I might as well just dump on them and talk louder because if I talk louder, then they’re really gonna understand it. And then they’re gonna be like, what is going on here? Then you’re gonna get an email saying- At least I’ve done my job. I dumped it on them. I dumped all this information. Now pay me 1%.

Well, what’s gonna happen is they’re gonna get an email saying, hey, thanks for everything, but we’re changing advisors. That’s what’ll happen. So you’re on the spot. You just made that up is actually brilliant. Let’s, maybe we call that the Garcia method. Something like that, right? Let’s just upload it into chat GPT. Write all my emails in the voice of Chuck Garcia. But you’re spot on. And maybe you don’t get through everything you wanted to in that meeting, but I would be willing to bet that the client is gonna feel a heck of a lot better. And you know what? If you have that understanding from them after they tell you what they don’t know, you might change your recommendations.

It’s true. So just stop, slow down, add that one question, listen, pivot, do what you gotta do. I love that. I think some of us do it. It’s just kind of there, but making it more part of your process. Put it in the playbook, in your fact finder, or whatever you do, add that question in there. You know, it’s really funny because I tried to apply this to my own experience over the last couple of decades in financial advice. I think I was actually doing this automatically. I think it was just kind of, it was wired in the system. Automagically? Autonomically? Autonomically. There’s a word I know, and I apologize for my failure in communication to you.

Terrible communication. But there is a word that happens without thinking about it. Like your heart is beating 100,000 times a day. That in my practice, I did this. I think actually asset map was the culmination of this. It was, here’s all the mess. Here’s all your stuff. Do you understand this stuff? And if not, we’re gonna educate. Transparency started the conversation, I think, for us, because the revelation of all the facts didn’t allow them to get buried behind the big conversations like, how should we invest your huge IRA? Even the small stuff that creates clutter and emotional uncertainty, like your policies are all messed up and someone sold you this annuity you don’t understand, but we’re kind of not really talking about it because it’s the pink elephant in the room.

And hey, by the way, the big account is more valuable. And so we just never address it. I mean, that those things become wounds that fester over time. I think a great fact-finding process where you could reveal somebody back to them like a mirror and say, okay, here’s where we need to work on the blemishes and here’s where we need to do some sit-ups. And I’m there with you. Let me help you understand why it’s important, not just go do push-ups. And they’re like, why am I doing all this work? The budgeting and the saving, that’s tough stuff for a lot of people that don’t feel comfortable.

You know, I think you’ve seen this many times in your career, I know I have. There’s a moment when you do have the right understanding and you’ve asked the question, you’ve added the process, just like you explained, you will see the client, there either will be like a little smile or you’ll see that their shoulders relax. There’s a little telltale sign where they get it. It all clicks. And there’s now clarity and understanding and really good things can happen. And that happens for the advisor too, when they truly understand. So not to get all wishy washy, but I think that that does happen. That feeling, that feeling when you see your client have that moment, it’s priceless.

Well, if it accrues to you and maybe even your brand and people are like telling all their friends about it, it has real revenue opportunity, right? We turned EQ into ROI. Oh, 100%. You’re thinking about it. I’m going from one meeting to the next, or I’m going from a meeting to go do case prep for another meeting or check emails. Your client, whether it’s a Zoom meeting or an in-person meeting, they’re going on to something else in their life, hanging out with the kids, going back to work, thinking about what they’re gonna do this weekend. And if you leave them feeling really good and confident, that’s powerful.

That’s ROI because of referrals. They’re gonna go say, man, I just had the most amazing meeting. That’s value. That’s solid communication. And that’s my dog in the background. I don’t even hear. But that’s good. I can hear him. He’s barking. He agrees with you. He agrees. He’s yelling at you. He’s saying, I agree. I agree. I agree. Or there’s a bird. And then he’s gonna lick you. That’s right. Or there’s a bird. If only dogs could speak English or whatever language. My dog doesn’t speak English. My dog is Lebanese. No kidding. Does he yell louder to the dog because he doesn’t understand sit, walk, and run?

I have to yell louder. He doesn’t get me otherwise. Now that is worthy of a meme. I have to say. Oh, totally, right? That’s great. Well, Derek, this has been really interesting and revealing. I think we just learned that our communication styles are completely a mess, but we have a lot of fun doing it. I’m gonna stop yelling at you so much. I’m sorry. Thank you. And I’ll stop trying to speak so deliberately. I love how you pronunciate your words. Don’t you? That’s my enunciation. That’s what they make fun of me. That’s not a real word, by the way. Pronunciation is a word. Pronunciate, it’s enunciate.

Or prono- Enunciate is what I’m doing. Pronunciate. Yeah. Whatever. Exactly, it’s one of those things. Okay. Let’s go back to using words like things and stuff. You know, like the things that stuff, you know, like that stuff. You know. Like totally, like this thing. I don’t even understand how the next generation is gonna communicate. Are they literally just like, they just saying, like, you know, like, like, you know, I don’t know, like, I’m like, you understand what you’re talking about. Drives me crazy, insane. Well, I learned from you that I said like too much. So I have made a concerted effort to fix that. And I like, I think getting better.

I think you are getting better. It’s an incredible improvement. We’re working on it. It’s amazing. I’m so proud of you. But actually, I think Derek, of anybody, you actually think about what we talk about in this and you put it into use. And we hope that the advisors are hearing something here and put something into action because this is intended to be a mentorship podcast. So hopefully this wasn’t just some fun fodder that, you know, made you laugh while you’re driving, but also give you an opportunity to inspire yourself, think about itself, challenge yourself, maybe challenge your kids because they need to help too. And hopefully lift others.

So with that, any closing comments on Chuck? Just, hey, thanks a ton. Mr. Chuck Garcia, you’re awesome. We’ll link to all his great stuff in the show notes. He was a great guest. So Chuck, thank you very much, my man. Absolutely. And please make sure that you also follow us on LinkedIn. Derek just opened up a brand new YouTube channel. So if you wanna listen to this podcast on YouTube, you can now do that. Search Rethink Financial Advice on YouTube. You’ll find it. You could binge watch them back to back to back. It’s really a fun way to do it. It’s not video, so you could just put it on in the background.

Of course, make sure that you like, reshare, post, put any ratings on this thing if you deserve it. Subscribe, all that fun stuff if you haven’t already. And of course, share this with your friends that would also appreciate it. With that, Derek, I look forward to seeing you on the next episode. Sounds good, brother. Great chat with you today. Thank you for listening to Rethink, the financial advisor podcast with Holt and Notman. Be sure to subscribe now and join the ongoing conversation. The information covered and posted represents the views and opinions of the guest and does not necessarily represent the views or opinions of AssetMap or Connector.

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